The Firearms Thread

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Kugelfisch
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by Kugelfisch » Sun Jun 07, 2020 10:00 pm

Me neither and it's unlikely I ever will due to how getting guns works here. The CZ was a failed attempt of some dude to pimp it. Otherwise you only get trash via the service weapon disciplines.

Without getting too far into it you can only get firearms required for disciplines your organization shoots. Doesn't matter if you personally do or your club does. But you have to be able to point a finger at a discipline and say "I need it for that.".
However, that only goes for two handguns. Any after that you need your club or any other club in that organization verify that you actually compete.
That's usually easy enough but between that, the limit of being able to only buy one firearm per six months, money being limited and the likely actual practical need for what you buy the gun owner market here is usually high end.

You have the odd hunter that super doesn't give a shit about whatever handgun he uses buy some cheap shit and eventually sell it for pocket change to some club. You have some sports shooters buy a junk service pistol to shoot the discipline a few times. But overall you're very unlikely to see the actual garbage.

I guess I could buy a HiPoint in 9mm and use it for target shooting. There's nothing that says I can't. It just has to have the minimal trigger pull force and be deemed safe.
But most people instead do what I do. Get one nice gun, shoot that discipline and for other calibres either have somebody lend you theirs or use a club-owned gun and save up for the next actual nice one. I don't own a 9mm for that reason. I could just get a Glawk but I'd rather save up and get a SigSauer.
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by rabidtictac » Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:17 am

There's no reason in the world to not get a Sig if you can afford it. I've shot a few pistols and some of my relatives have shot a hell of a lot more than me and they still say Sigs are the best of the lot. The only guns I've seen seriously put up against Sigs in terms of quality are .45s from .45fags (including customs like kimber) and some of the vintage pieces like the Luger 9mm and Walter p38. I'm sure both are great guns and piece of history, but they cost an actual fortune here in the states.

The only reason to buy any pistol other than a Sig is if you just want something else or if you can't afford the Sig yet. And I guess if you want a type of pistol that Sig doesn't make, like a revolver or something. Sig might make revolvers, but if they do then I don't know about it and I'm guessing they don't make carry pieces.
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Kugelfisch
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by Kugelfisch » Mon Jun 08, 2020 4:39 am

Sig doesn't make revolvers. They make the best pistols around and some of the finest match rifles. But if we're talking about precision rifles they are clearly beat by Haenel, the company you may know from such hits as the MP 40 or the Sturmgewehr 44.
These days Haenel makes the RS9, better known under it's Bundeswehr name as the G29 , being the likely best precision rifle in Lapua Magnum and my true waifu.
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.338 Lapua Mag. Five bucks a shot. Hits at 2km (1.2miles) range are trivial. Fitted with a Steiner M5Xi 5–25x56 designed for ranges of above 1,5km(0.93miles). I better stop now. I've already jerked off today.


But as far as pistols go, SIG in the past and SigSauer in the present make the best autoloaders in 9mm Luger no contest. I will say that .45 ACP is debatable. In terms of quality they are top of the line but you may wish something other design-wise.
If we're really, really going down the rabbit hole about who makes the very best revolver it's going to be Janz.
That's not even debated. You know the reputation of Korth? They went bankrupt and Janz were the ones that supplied the precision instruments to make those in the first place. A Janz fixed calibre revolver is the absolute peak of precision and makes a current Korth look like amateur hour. But It'll cost you a cool 5k€. Then again, made in my home state of SH and the tippy toppest of the tip tops. It shoots much better than you ever will unless you're a world champion so you decide if you even need that degree or excellence. I don't.

You may think I'm very biased as all those weapons are German. But that's just because the very best of the best currently are. Ask me about other times and I would point you towards Switzerland, France, Belgium or the USA. But as of right now most of the best guns are from Germany.

Except for automatic intermediate rifles, or salt rifles, in those regards I think either the USA or Russia make the best. But that's talking practicality in the battlefield, not who makes the most accurate, well-made one for the most part. But semi-automatic 5.56 rifle I'd go with USA and 7.62 Short I'd go with Russia, namely AR-15 and AK 103 respectively.
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by rabidtictac » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:41 am

Well, the assault rifle is basically a do-everything gun. It doesn't have to be the most accurate or the most powerful or even the most durable. Like most compromise designs, the gun just has to be good enough at everything. An AR or AK platform gun can be modified into a designated marksman rifle, general infantry gun, cut down to almost SMG size or pretty much any other design you can think of. 5.56 and 7.62 are likewise perfectly good enough and don't need to be anything different than what they are.

You reach a point in any design, particularly weapons, where you start to see diminishing returns and trade-offs in specialization. That's why most weapons are compromise designs. Even a criteria like "well-made" has to be taken in moderation, because no army wants to pay $3000-5000 to outfit their soldiers with custom handguns or some other bullshit they won't use. How much the army wants to spend varies from country to country, but they all want value for money (unless there's crony capitalism happening behind the scenes, like with the F-35 Lightning II Superscammer plane.)
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by Kugelfisch » Mon Jun 08, 2020 6:40 am

Sure, that's nice for the military. But as a civilian you can get better stuff. Practically, I'd likely go with US or RU stuff. But if I wanted the best of the best I'd have to take either German or Swizz parts.
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by rabidtictac » Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:45 am

You can get way better sidearms as a civvie, especially. They don't issue Sigs to the military because Sigs are more expensive than the Shitretta 92FuckSake or whatever crappy gun they're using now.
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I've never shot a Beretta, for the record, but I did shoot a helwan, which is an sandnigger copy. It was ok but not nearly as nice as a propa sig.
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da PAC Nigguh
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by da PAC Nigguh » Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:43 pm

rabidtictac wrote:
Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:45 am
They don't issue Sigs to the military
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_Sauer_M17
In May 2017, the Army announced that the first unit that will receive the M17 would be the 101st Airborne Division by the end of the year. At the same time, the rest of the U.S. Armed Forces revealed they also intend to acquire the handgun, making it the standard sidearm for the entire U.S. military. The services plan to procure up to 421,000 weapons in total; 195,000 for the Army, 130,000 for the Air Force, 61,000 for the Navy (M18 compact version only), and 35,000 for the Marines.
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by rabidtictac » Mon Jun 08, 2020 5:13 pm

da PAC Nigguh wrote:
Mon Jun 08, 2020 3:43 pm
rabidtictac wrote:
Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:45 am
They don't issue Sigs to the military
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/SIG_Sauer_M17
In May 2017, the Army announced that the first unit that will receive the M17 would be the 101st Airborne Division by the end of the year. At the same time, the rest of the U.S. Armed Forces revealed they also intend to acquire the handgun, making it the standard sidearm for the entire U.S. military. The services plan to procure up to 421,000 weapons in total; 195,000 for the Army, 130,000 for the Air Force, 61,000 for the Navy (M18 compact version only), and 35,000 for the Marines.
I stand corrected. Finally a good decision.

Edit: No surprise it was during Trump's administration. Based
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by Kugelfisch » Mon Jun 08, 2020 8:44 pm

rabidtictac wrote:
Mon Jun 08, 2020 7:45 am
You can get way better sidearms as a civvie, especially. They don't issue Sigs to the military because Sigs are more expensive than the Shitretta 92FuckSake or whatever crappy gun they're using now.
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I've never shot a Beretta, for the record, but I did shoot a helwan, which is an sandnigger copy. It was ok but not nearly as nice as a propa sig.
I have to disagree with that. My club has a Beretta 92FS. The absolute simplest, basic bitch version. If you want to shoot 9mm that day but don't have a 9mm you'd get that one if somebody was there before you and grabbed the Sig.
We also used to have a CZ 75. The one that slung it's rear sight into my face. Not a fault of that gun as it was some after market crap that didn't actually fit so the previous owner drilled a bigger hole into the slide and affixed it (evidently poorly) with a screw.

Anyway, I vastly preferred the Beretta. It's just as accurate but I shot better with it because I find it much more comfortable in the hand. In theory the lower barrel of the CZ is supposedly better for recoil control. In practise I found that to get nullified by it being an uncomfortable piece of shit. :lol:
When shooting "Duell"* I was consistently better with the Beretta. Naturally, the Sig surpassed both but then it's a long barrel, carefully weighted match gun as opposed to the regular service model Beretta and CZ.
The slide lock is much better and on the CZ I'd sometimes accidentally engage the safety.
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Because it's oh so reasonable to have a gun you can choke up on fairly high and then put a fucking safety just over your thumb. Real stellar design. There's a reason why most good pistols have the safety under your thumb or none at all.
Is it obvious yet that I don't like the CZ 75? It's the same shit as with Glock. Massive army of fanboys for mediocre to bad guns just because they are "afordable" but need extensive modding to actually become half as good as a Sig is out of the box.

The reason the US military complained about the Beretta is that they were old and often not that well cared for. Most of the issues, as is often the case with pistols, stemmed from the magazines being treated like shit and being beat up over the years.
The club's Beretta is reasonably cared for and supremely reliable.
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*25m, target flips open, 5 shots in 7.5 seconds on this target:
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In comparison, this is the "Präzisions" target:
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Both are the same size. The bullseye of the Präzi is about the size of a bottlecap. You can just about make out the white, horizontal lines of the Duell target. They provide a little bit of guidance as to where the middle is because the rest appears completely black at 25m away.
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Re: The Firearms Thread

Post by rabidtictac » Mon Jun 08, 2020 9:22 pm

Beretta better than CZ? Next you'll be telling me that walmart toilet paper is better than the rusty nail for wiping your ass! I'm pretty sure I shot a CZ and pretty sure I wasn't impressed. Besides which, the military Berettas are shit garbage, as any vet will tell you. They get battered and knocked around and they don't like it.
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Another gun overrated by poorfags and /k/ is the makarov. Yeah, it works, but you won't enjoy it. I do like how easy a single stack is to load, but the gun is pretty "snappy" when firing and the round isn't that powerful. I have a nice one and it's a great piece of history, but it's not a gun to shoot all the time. I'd honestly worry about wearing it out, too, because they're not built as tough as you might think.
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>liberal: ban x
>trump: yeah ban x
>liberal: no bro x is awesome

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